Rank Your Dylan!

[Otis Westinghouse]

Self Portrait makes a top 10 shock!

Mike: do you rate the production on TOOM higher than OM, or do you hate it equally? I prefer it to Empire Burlesque any day of the week. You have a point re egotism and 'his sound', but then again what's wrong with a producer having their own distinctive sound? It clearly (from Chronicles)took some time and work for things to gel with Lanois, so maybe he wasn't the ideal choice to set the tape running, but doing a second LP with him indicates some level of satisfaction. I do think a good chunk of the brilliance of Not Dark Yet is down to the production. As Andy Gill (the Gang of Four one) says in the notes in this month's Mojo on this entry in the top 100, it has the most langurous sound ever. It makes you think of someone in a hot house in a dry area, lizards on the walls, time running out. It's amazing as it has not only the mighty Jim Keltner on drums, but another drummer as well as percussionist. All that layering and texturing matches the depth of the sentiments.

[Mike Boom]

Otis
I like TOOM much better than Oh Mercy, and obviously his kind of production works better on some songs more than others - Not Dark Yet being a good example of it actually working. I think production is very much a personal taste thing - I mean I think Lanois suits some bands - like U2 for example but not others - Dylan for instance. I think a producer needs to have a sound to suit the songs - half the battle I think is just finding an artist that matches a sound. I LOVE Phil Spectors productions for instance, but I dont think "the Wall of Sound" would suit some artists, yet others it actually enhances - if you get my drift. But Dylan is at his best when you get his first take on something , no matter how rough, and keep it simple - Nick Lowe for example would be a great producer for Dylan, all in my humble opinion of course.
Books? I really enjoyed both "Down the Highway" AND "Behind the Shades" - I think "Down the Highway" was better. Am enjoying "Simple Twist of Fate very much - and the bits of "On the Road" that I skimmed thru were a fascinating behind the scenes look - and might just be the most interesting yet, I'll let you know.

p.s
ITUNES is a good resource if you want to pick up the odd song off a Dylan album, its only a dollar a song.

[Otis Westinghouse]

And a CD from the library is only £1! (At least there's some payment involved.)

UK Amazon reviews of Sounes 'Down The Highway' seem pretty dire. One person very much in favour, others quite harsh: 'I'm left with the feeling that Sounes could have written about anyone - Elton John or Max Bygraves or whoever - and he would have employed the same automatic pilot procedure with no special feeling for his subject. Heylin's biography has its flaws. It's very opinionated but I feel that's the price you have to pay for a book with distinction and wit. He also makes you feel that all those Dylan stories you probably already know seem fresh with all the additional detail he provides. That's the book to read. Definitely not this.' Though needless to say, when you visit Heylin, you get equal harshness: 'If you own more than 30 Dylan albums, you've probably already got this book (and no doubt really enjoyed it for the content rather than the style). If you haven't, then "Down the Highway" by Howard Sounes is a better buy.' Well that's Amazon for you. The Shelton book is one I've heard praised, and of course Amazon has a one star entry and a 5 star one! CP Lee's Like The Night looks promising.

I haven't read (the late) Ian McDonald's Revolution in the Head book on the Beatles, but I'm after the equivalent of that (more unanimity of praise on amazon for this, 'the book by which all others must be measured'). Maybe it doesnt exist for Dylan. Something with both lots of interesting details that's well written and full of insight.

[Bad Ambassador]

The music mag reviews listed on the cover of the Sounes' book suggest quality. I bought it the other day for £4 in HMV, I'll let you know if I ever get the time to read the bugger. Still on Chronicles Vol1 right now - slow going due to a multitude of things to do.

[Masterpiece?]

Whats wrong with Oh Mercy? Well, you answered yourself. "Modern Production". Or to be more specific Daniel Lanois. The guy is the ultimate egotist in that he makes everyone sound like himself - whether its U2 or The Neville Brothers or Bob Dylan. Does every bloody song have to have an ambient drone in the background and be awash with "The Edge" like infinite guitar, or whatever the fuck he calls it? All Dylan needs is someone to start the tape running and try to convince him to leave his best songs on the finished record, not somone who wants to manufacture some "modern" sound and cover perfectly good songs in a gloopy mess.

I think wishing every Dylan song was bare-bones is like wishing every Elvis album was "My Aim Is True." Why is EC allowed his indulgences and accepted for them but Dylan held to some standard of purity? The man isn't God, after all. And if Dylan picked Lanois, it's probably because he wanted his songs to sound like Lanois makes things sound.

I can understand people's distaste for the 80's sound on EB, but Oh Mercy was not overindulgent or obnoxious in the least. It took great songs and made them sound beautiful, IMHO.

[Bad Ambassador]

I can understand people's distaste for the 80's sound on EB, but Oh Mercy was not overindulgent or obnoxious in the least. It took great songs and made them sound beautiful, IMHO.

Seconded.

[Mike Boom]

err - where the fuck exactly did I say every Dylan song had to be bare bones? Its not anything to do with purity - I never said that either - I said production that suits the songs and the artist - and he actually picked Lanois because he was at such a loss as to what to do in the studio at the time that he let Bono convince him to use Lanois.
You like Oh Mercy - fine, lots of other people do too - I dont - I think the production sucks - but please dont put words in my mouth.

Oh and Dylan isnt God? Thanks for putting me straight.

[invisible Pole]

My ranking (limited only to CD's I own):
1. Blonde On Blonde
2. Blood On The Tracks
3. Highway 61 Revisited
4. Another Side Of Bob Dylan
5. Bringing It All Back Home
6. John Wesley Harding
7. Time Out Of Mind
8. The Freewheelin’ Bob Dylan
9. Love & Theft
10. The Times They Are A-Changin’

[Masterpiece?]

err - where the fuck exactly did I say every Dylan song had to be bare bones? Its not anything to do with purity - I never said that either - I said production that suits the songs and the artist - and he actually picked Lanois because he was at such a loss as to what to do in the studio at the time that he let Bono convince him to use Lanois.
You like Oh Mercy - fine, lots of other people do too - I dont - I think the production sucks - but please dont put words in my mouth.

Oh and Dylan isnt God? Thanks for putting me straight.

Jeez, it was an opinion about music, why so hostile? Sorry...

[Richard]

There are gaps in my Dylan knowledge, but here are my favorites from what I know.

1. Blonde On Blonde
I love the 'wild mercury sound' description of this album, even if I don't know what it means. Visions of Johanna could be my favorite Dylan track.

2. The Basement Tapes
Chaotic & ramshacle at times, but always gripping & frequently hilarious.

3. John Wesley Harding
Great sound! The songs have the quality of a series of covers of old time long forgotten music. But of course they are not.

4. Blood On The Tracks
Largely a moving collections of songs about relationshsips changing, time passing & the past being a foreign country. Gets more relevant every year I am on this mortal coil.

5. Time Out Of Mind
I buy into the concerns about Daniel Lanois' production stlye, even though I love this & like Oh Mercy. But for me hearing this was a significant shock. Where did this come from after so long in the wilderness?

6. Bringing It All Back Home
Immensely enjoyable. Still laugh out loud funny, even after hundreds of plays.

7. Highway 61 Revisited
Should be on anyones list just for the great cover picture! CDs be damned, this needs the full vinyl size reprint. And if your fall for the cover make sure you are sitting down for the whipcrack drum that kicks off Rolling Stone.

8. Nashville Skyline
I am willing to concede it is slight compared to the power & complexity of the other great Dylans albums, but I have never heard his voice like this again.

9. Love And Theft
Didn't have the shock value Time Out Of Mind arrived with, at least to me, but a great follow-up & combined the best one, two punch since possibly the sixties heyday.

10. Oh Mercy!
Had a huge impact on me in the 80s. Haven't replayed it much since, & when I do I may join the scorn for the production (Robbie Robertson's solo debut anyone?) but remember Man In The Long Black Coat beinga classic.

I have no memory of listening to Infidels all the way through, but I do have a soft-spot for Jokerman. Largely thanks to the video I remembered coming out as I was in an art history class. A series of images taken from the great works of art, mostly echoing the religious imagery of this song. I'd love to see it again.

I am enjoying the lists. Surprising the uniformity. Dylan really does seem to have a much more agreed upon canon than our Elvis. Perhaps I need to venture to a Dylan board to see people making a strong case for Under The Red Sky.

[Mike Boom]

I think wishing every Dylan song was bare-bones is like wishing every Elvis album was "My Aim Is True." Why is EC allowed his indulgences and accepted for them but Dylan held to some standard of purity? The man isn't God, after all.

Masterpiece, I just dont appreciate being pigeon holed as some sort of puritan who only likes "Bare Bones Dylan", thanks very much. If you make a post grossly misrepresenting what I say, you can expect some hositility in return. See?

[Masterpiece?]

I can expect to be corrected, I don't have to expect hostility. That's what you choose to bring to it. See?

[Who Shot Sam?]

Masterpiece, I just dont appreciate being pigeon holed as some sort of puritan who only likes "Bare Bones Dylan", thanks very much. If you make a post grossly misrepresenting what I say, you can expect some hositility in return. See?

It's hardly a gross misinterpretation of what you said. A misinterpretation perhaps, but certainly not meriting the kind of hostility he got in return. You said "Dylan is at his best when you get his first take on something , no matter how rough, and keep it simple." Sounds like bare bones Dylan to me.

[Mike Boom]

You said "Dylan is at his best when you get his first take on something , no matter how rough, and keep it simple." Sounds like bare bones Dylan to me.

Sorry, but this is bullshit also - is a first take of a twelve peice band bare bones? Simple production does not equal bare bones music at all.

And sheesh, when did everyone get soo fragile around here?

[Who Shot Sam?]

You said "Dylan is at his best when you get his first take on something , no matter how rough, and keep it simple." Sounds like bare bones Dylan to me.

Sorry, but this is bullshit also - is a first take of a twelve peice band bare bones? Simple production does not equal bare bones music at all.

And sheesh, when did everyone get soo fragile around here?

I bow to your musical knowledge. I know you've been playing his stuff on guitar so you must have a more enlightened perspective than all us non-musicians.

I'm not fragile numbnuts. How do you like that for hostility? Nothing personal of course.

[Mike Boom]

Mr Numbnuts to you.

[Who Shot Sam?]

Mr Numbnuts to you.

Fair enough.

It's only bullshitting about music, for God's sake.

[El Vez]

Jeepers, I just can't stay away from this one...

1. John Wesley Harding

David Rawlings pointed out something which I think is pretty fascinating about this record. Almost every song is exactly three verses with no chorus and they all have close to the same number of words to them. I have no idea if that was something conscious that Dylan was doing or not but it's interesting to think about when you're listening to it. I've gone on about this record a lot over the years but I think what I love most about it is how prescient Dylan was in predicting the fallout of the 60's with all these obscure parables about breathing the air around Tom Paine and St. Augustine carrying a coat of solid gold.

2. The Basement Tapes

I have to qualify this one by saying that I'm also thinking about the unreleased gems like "I Am Your Teenage Prayer," "Sign On The Cross," "All American Boy,""Tupelo," and "I'm Not There." This is the loosest and most engaging stuff Dylan ever recorded and it still has a little of that "I'm not supposed to know this exists" excitement to it.

3. Time Out of Mind

Extremely personal connection to this record. Came out a couple of weeks after my first real breakup and I gravitated to songs like "Highlands" and "Standin' In The Doorway" to a degree that probably wasn't healthy.

4. Blood On The Tracks

I have a hard time listening to almost anything else from the early/mid 70's sensitive singer/songwriter era because this makes what everyone else was doing in that genre look like nothing. "Down the highway/Down the tracks/Down the road to ecstacy/I followed you underneath the stars/Haunted by your memory/And all your raging glory." There's never been anything that's come close to that for me.

5. Another Side of Bob Dylan

Again, Dylan was so far ahead of what his contemporaries were doing that it was kind of pitiful. "To Ramona" breaks my heart.

6. Highway 61 Revisited

I think "Desolation Row" was the song that made it impossible for me to take what my friends were listening to seriously. After the verse about Einstein disguised as Robin Hood, how could you go from that to the Barenaked Ladies. No offense to those guys or anything but it's not even in the same galaxy.

7. World Gone Wrong

This is on the strength of "Delia" and "Blood In My Eyes" which I think are his two greatest vocal performances. I love Dylan's brokedown bluesman persona and this record, more than Good As I've Been To You, is the real launching pad of that reinvention.

8. The Times They Are A-Changin'

Really, really grim record but the songs are so incredible that I never get tired of it. "The Lonesome Death of Hattie Carroll" and "Boots of Spanish Leather" are, in my opinion, his best pre-electric songs.

9. Blonde On Blonde

Some of the performances are kind of shrill but what can you say in the face of something as beautiful as "Visions of Johanna" or as fucked up sinister as "Stuck Inside of Mobile With The Memphis Blues Again."

10. Love & Theft

I bought this and John Hiatt's The Tiki Bar Is Open on 9/11 to help me through that day and I owe them both a debt for that.


As far as books on Dylan go, avoid the Spitz book which is just bitter and mean and shines no light on the man or his art. Sounes' book gives us a different glimpse of Dylan but I don't think he has anything interesting to say about the records themselves. Song & Dance Man is fascinating and comprehensive but the guy goes on for three pages about a single line from Dylan's World Gone Wrong liner notes and that kind of excessiveness makes it heavy going at times.I like Clinton Heylin's Recording Sessions book although it gets a little hyperbolic at times and Invisible Republic gets on my nerves something fierce because Greil Marcus is someone I kinda want to smack upside the head. Loved Chronicles and next to that I'd have to say that any of Paul Williams' books are excellent and provide a lot of insight into Dylan's live performances.

[Who Shot Sam?]

Jeepers, I just can't stay away from this one...

1. John Wesley Harding

David Rawlings pointed out something which I think is pretty fascinating about this record. Almost every song is exactly three verses with no chorus and they all have close to the same number of words to them. I have no idea if that was something conscious that Dylan was doing or not but it's interesting to think about when you're listening to it. I've gone on about this record a lot over the years but I think what I love most about it is how prescient Dylan was in predicting the fallout of the 60's with all these obscure parables about breathing the air around Tom Paine and St. Augustine carrying a coat of solid gold.

El Vez, do you have the recent reissue of this one and if so do you have any problems wwith the remastering? I've heard all kinds of conflicting reports about it.

[Mike Boom]

It's only bullshitting about music, for God's sake.

Wow, thanks for the heads up.
Glad to see the humour by pass was a success.

[El Vez]

WSS,

I've actually stayed away from it because I've heard exactly the same stuff about the reissue. Personally, I think the sound is great on the old cd I have (which I've had for twelve years now, come to think of it) and even if it is a bit flat, I think it adds to the claustrophobic atmosphere that Dylan seemed to be going for.

[Who Shot Sam?]

It's only bullshitting about music, for God's sake.

Wow, thanks for the heads up.
Glad to see the humour by pass was a success.

Man are you defensive. Was just trying to say no big deal - I understand that you don't dig Lanois and I can respect that. I'm going to bed before this goes any further.

[bambooneedle]

" "No reason to get excited," the thief, he kindly spoke,
"There are many here among us who feel that life is but a joke.
But you and I, we've been through that, and this is not our fate,
So let us not talk falsely now, the hour is getting late." " ~ All Along The Watchtower

[bambooneedle]

The Paul Williams Performing Artist books are among the more honest and lucid explorations of the art. Of the biographies, I found Robert Shelton's No Direction Home the most enjoyable one as he gives in my opinion the most interesting look into Dylan's early history as something of an insider.

There are also some superb compendiums of writings on Dylan, like All Across The Telegraph (edited by Michael Gray and John Bauldie) and Bob Dylan, A Retrospective (edited by Craig McGregor, who lectured at my old design school). The publishing dates on my copies of the last two are '88 and '72 respectively, so I don't know if they're still in print, but they're just a great cross reference to dozens of the best written journalistic contributions till then, which also include stuff like the famous and funny Playboy interview (turned out to be all written by Dylan himself, after a dispute with credited writer Nat Hentoff), stuff from beat poets etc.

Also, there's Rolling Thunder Logbook by writer Sam Shepard - great takes on going ons, people, places, things, events... of that tour. It's much more than a logbook... Not sure whether that's in print now, either.

But there are hundreds of books on Bob Dylan, check out this guide: http://www.taxhelp.com/toc.html

[Otis Westinghouse]

Wow, it could take a day's research just to think of which books to read. Apparently Sounes is £4 in HMV, so I may start there, even if he hasn't much of interedt to say about the songs! Bit tedious though, I want a good mix of bio and interesting analysis (as I said above!). Something that everyone recognises is good, like the Buckley book on Bowie (which, believe it or not, I haven't read), or Shakey (also not read, I'm not big on rock books, to be honest, but am getting moreso).

Thanks Rich and Elv for your typically interesting contributions. Love your notes. Less uniformity from both of you. JWH riding high! I can hear it's very interesting and will repay much analysis, but can't imagine it blowing my socks off like the other typical high flyers. World Gone Wrong has moved up a few notches in the 'should get' list.

Interesting re the uniformity of structure on JWH. After reading Chronicles, I can imagine he felt he had hit the perfect structure at that point and all songs should conform to it. It's amazing how many songs he can do that have an AAAAA... structure and still be rivetting. It's almost a lesson that interest, excitement, brilliance and all of that come from the character of the song more than any structure, and if the character dictates repetition of one verse, then that is what it shall be. Loads of his songs have no middle 8, or a chorus that is no great departure from the verse.

That's a great quote from Idiot Wind, Elv. And I love the idea of you pitying your contemporary Barenaked Ladies' fans! I keep thinking of the line, often quoted for its stunning impact, from Visions of Johanna: 'The ghost of electricity howls in the bones of her face'. You would never tire of that.