Your Ten Favourite......Morrissey Songs

Mike Boom · Post by **Mike Boom** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 11:18 pm

I Will See You In Far Off Places
Suedehead
A Swallow On My Neck
Maladjusted
Wide To Receive
Black Eyed Susan
Seasick, Yet Still Docked (Beethoven Was Deaf Version)
Everyday Is Like Sunday
Dear God, Please Help Me
I Know Very Well How I Got My Name

Mechanical Grace · Post by **Mechanical Grace** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:09 am

VERY tough one for me, as Viva Hate and You Are the Quarry are nearly perfect start to finish. I did a cop-out version of this list earlier but have whipped myself into shape now (list is alphabetical):

Come Back To Camden
Driving Your Girlfriend Home
Everyday Is Like Sunday
Hairdresser On Fire
King Leer*
Late Night Maudlin Street
Let Me Kiss You
Now My Heart Is Full
Seasick, Still Docked
Trouble Loves Me

*Now I have this in my head...
I tried to surprise you
I lay down beside you
And nothing much happened
And you didn't phone me
You didn't even phone me
Because it's not your style
...to dial

Otis Westinghouse · Post by **Otis Westinghouse** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:01 pm

I trust Bengali In Platforms is one thing that makes VH less than perfect! Yuk.

Not too original [actually, I now see 5 of these aren't above, though that was partly deliberate!], but...

Now My Heart Is Full
Why Don't You Find Out For Yourself?
The More You Ignore Me, The Closer I Get
Suedehead
Everyday Is Like Sunday
Trouble Loves Me
Dear God, Please Help Me
You Have Killed Me
First Of The Gang To Die
You're Gonna Need Someone On Your Side

Well here I am, well her I am...

I still don't know Maladjusted or Southpaw Grammar, same as I don't know Meat Is Murder (and I think at the end of the day I'm just too committed a carnivore to want that in the house), but got to know Trouble Loves Me from him playing it on tour this year. One other song I would have included a few years ago was Ouija Board, which is, I think, not highly regarded, but which I love. 'Oh she is gone from this unhappy planet...' (though forget the bledding carnivores ref in the next line!).

Mechanical Grace · Post by **Mechanical Grace** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:11 pm

Otis Westinghouse wrote:I trust Bengali In Platforms is one thing that makes VH less than perfect! Yuk.

Exactly. Horrible. I'm also totally offended by All The Lazy Dykes. What is his problem?

Boy With A Problem · Post by **Boy With A Problem** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 5:12 am

I'm not qualified to list ten Morrissey songs, but two I like that I didn't see mentioned are "Interesting Drug" and "Last of the International Playboys." I just now re-listened to "All The Lazy Dykes" - not sure what's offensive about this - I thought dyke was a word, like queer, that has been "taken back" by the gay community. I know that there was a court battle a couple of years ago for a group calling itself "Dykes on Bikes" to be able to continue using the term on the grounds that the word dyke was no longer derogatory - I think in the song, Morrissey makes mention of bikes.

RinghioStarr · Post by **RinghioStarr** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 8:01 am

Everyday Is Like Sunday
Boxers
Mexico (better if live)
Satan Rejected My Soul (better if live)
Sister I'm A Poet (beethoven was deaf live album)
Whatever Happens I Love You
Why Don't You Find Out For Yourself
Lifeguard Sleeping, Girl Drowning
The More You Ignore Me The Closer I Get
Seasick, Yet Still Docked

I think that both You Are The Quarry and Ringleader are crap.

Otis Westinghouse · Post by **Otis Westinghouse** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 8:04 am

I'll leave MG to expand, but I think it comes across as a dyke-misogynist song. There's some very skewed logic in Mozzer's career. he dismisses the racist accusations with 'as if I could ever be that', yet how else can a line about a Bengali such as 'life is hard enough when you belong here', despite a sense of sympathy, be anything else? I just wish he hadn't gone near any of this stuff. It's in the past now, he's grown up some, but it will always leave a sour whiff over his solo career. The Elvis Ray Charles incident is dismissable in comparison.

I love Interesting Drug too. Have it on a Q mag 90s 'Drive' cassette for the car, which still gets good use as only have cassette in our 1988 trusty Toyota. great song. Vid is fun too. Playboys excites me less. It's OK.

Otis Westinghouse · Post by **Otis Westinghouse** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 8:18 am

Ringhio: like me you're clearly a Vauxhall and I fan. Lifeguard is a fantastic song. Beethoven is getting some good nods here. I thought it was probably inessential, but maybe not! Intersing opinion on the last two. I found Quarry to be a real grower, rate it highly. ROTT I loved from the off, but it doesn't last in the mind quite so well, but it's highlights are very high. Are you Italian? No sense of thrill with all the Italianness on it? I was at a meeting in Italy last year and heard precisely the same train blast that is at the beginning of The Youngest Was The Most Loved, gave me a huge kick! That's such a specifically Italian sound. And I do love the Visconti production.

Mechanical Grace · Post by **Mechanical Grace** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 8:52 am

Otis Westinghouse wrote:I'll leave MG to expand, but I think it comes across as a dyke-misogynist song. There's some very skewed logic in Mozzer's career.

Agreed, and you're right that it's not the use of the word 'Dyke' that offends me at all, it's the word 'lazy'. He really doesn't like women very much in general; very few of the female figures in his songs are more than objects of contempt. That's one reason I love 'Driving Your Girlfriend Home;' it's much more specific and sympathetic, whether the narrator likes her or not. Such a great little snippet of screwed-up relationships. 'King Leer' is a comic take on the same topic. And you could tap-dance to it!

Mike Boom · Post by **Mike Boom** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 10:05 am

Otis
Beethoven is a fantastic live album - just about every version on it supasses the recorded version - especially "Seasick..." and "Jack the Ripper".

MG

very few of the female figures in his songs are more than objects of contempt.

To be fair I think the men in his songs pretty much suffer the same fate.

Ringhio - Im not a huge fan of "Quarry" - dont like the production much and I think they left all the best songs off the record. I love "Never Played Symphonies", "Mexico" and "Munich Air Disaster...".
BUT "Ringleader" is top notch - not sure why you dislike it?

Mechanical Grace · Post by **Mechanical Grace** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 10:47 am

Mike Boom wrote:To be fair I think the men in his songs pretty much suffer the same fate.

True enough! But all the human detail and interest-- and there's a lot of that, or we wouldn't be so addicted-- is in men. I don't in the least have a problem with that; people should write about what interests them. What pisses me off is when he goes a step past that and casts his few women as lazy dykes, girls pretending to drown, and bitches who deign to let their poor innocent boyfriends buy them rings.

I have more of a problem with Bengali In Platforms, though, than I do with most of his misogynist turns, and I for one never got the big whoop over National Front Disco, which has a parent (or similar) as a narrator who keeps bemoaning the "loss of our boy." I always assumed the hopeful tone around his conversion to casual fascism was always meant to be pathetic, a sad commentary on what boys will do to feel powerful and fit in, and how easily they're pulled into things in the name of teenage rebellion. But maybe I'm being naive.

PS- I just noticed that the hilarious, ultra-'80s love song Hairdresser On Fire is not on my CD copy of Viva Hate. WTF????

Otis Westinghouse · Post by **Otis Westinghouse** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 11:26 am

Nicely put, but what troubles me is that the overall sentiment that emerges from the song is not to do with the parents (and the loss is first attributed to friends, and then the narrator and then mum, so it's a more general loss), but in the combination of 'England for the English' with the stirring, wistful and very lovely guitar music, and 'you want the day to come sooner' sounds entirely likes it's celebrating the optimism of England for the English, and the scary idea of 'settling the score'. The BNP, as the NF is now called, might find it a little subtle, but they could happily claim it as theirs:

David, the wind blows
The wind blows ...
Bits of your life away
Your friends all say ...
"Where is our boy ? Oh, we've lost our boy"
But they should know
Where you've gone
Because again and again you've explained that
You're going to ...

Oh, you're going to ...
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
England for the English !
England for the English !

David, the winds blow
The winds blow ...
All of my dreams away
And I still say :
"Where is our boy ? Ah, we've lost our boy"
But I should know
Why you've gone
Because again and again you've explained
You've gone to the ...

National, ah ...
To the National ..
There's a country; you don't live there
But one day you would like to
And if you show them what you're made of
Oh, then you might do ...

But David, we wonder
We wonder if the thunder
Is ever really gonna begin
Begin, begin
Your mom says :
"I've lost my boy"
But she should know
Why you've gone
Because again and again you've explained
You've gone to the :

National
To the National
To the National Front Disco
Because you want the day to come sooner
You want the day to come sooner
You want the day to come sooner
When you've settled the score

Oh, the National
Oh, the National
Oh, the National
Oh, the National

Mechanical Grace · Post by **Mechanical Grace** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 11:44 am

Otis Westinghouse wrote:...the combination of 'England for the English' with the stirring, wistful and very lovely guitar music, and 'you want the day to come sooner' sounds entirely likes it's celebrating the optimism of England for the English

That's true. It's such a great rousing tune, and it is impossible to enjoy it without thinking maybe that puts you on the wrong side.

Mike Boom · Post by **Mike Boom** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:33 pm

That's true. It's such a great rousing tune, and it is impossible to enjoy it without thinking maybe that puts you on the wrong side.

Exactly - which is I guess is what he's trying to do.
It all gets very subtle and of course subtlety is pretty much lost in todays pop world. But I think its very similar to the "Born in the USA" thing that Springsteen went through - the focus of the lyric is lost in the anthemic rise of the music for the chorus of "BORN IN THE USA!"

"Bengali" kinda makes me squirm, mainly for the word "belong" - its a pity because the music behind it is beautiful.

As far as misogyny goes, in the Smiths songs particularly I think, it was confusing for starters what gender he was singing about , as a lot of the songs could be taken either way, but generally I think he admires women, just look at all the cover stars - and certainly in interviews of the time he says as much, also his closest (only?) friend of the time was the infamous Linder , a staunch feminist and supporter of womens rights in her art. However I do tend to agree that lyrically in his solo work he does become rather sour towards women or as you say , casts them in shallow bit parts - but more probably because he doesnt mix with any or know many closely than due to any hatred of women in general ??

RinghioStarr · Post by **RinghioStarr** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 2:48 pm

Otis Westinghouse wrote:Ringhio: like me you're clearly a Vauxhall and I fan. Lifeguard is a fantastic song. Beethoven is getting some good nods here. I thought it was probably inessential, but maybe not! Intersing opinion on the last two. I found Quarry to be a real grower, rate it highly. ROTT I loved from the off, but it doesn't last in the mind quite so well, but it's highlights are very high. Are you Italian? No sense of thrill with all the Italianness on it? I was at a meeting in Italy last year and heard precisely the same train blast that is at the beginning of The Youngest Was The Most Loved, gave me a huge kick! That's such a specifically Italian sound. And I do love the Visconti production.

Yes, Vauxhall is by far the best M.'s solo album, in my opinion. There are many other songs in this album that I like, such as Billy Budd, Spring-heeled Jim, I Am Hated For Loving. Also, it is closely connected to Costello's Brutal Youth in my mind, because I bought both of them around may 1994, and they were the albums of the year to me.

I eagerly put my hands on Quarry as it came out, after the seven years' hiatus without Morrissey's releases, but it was a huge disappointment. He lost me since then. I almost never put that record on, and when I do... a "psychological teeth-grinding" starts. I think that its highlights are very catchy at best, but no more than that. It's the same old song, but without the inspiration.

And the "italianness" of Ringleader didn't do any miracle, either. I'd rather having him recording in Jamaica or Sweden than here, if this means a better album...
Anyway, there are some "italian sounds" in it, you're right. Plus those cultural references, Pasolini, Magnani etc.
He even mentions "piazza Cavour" but he gets the pronunciation wrong so that it can rhyme with "what's my life for"...

RinghioStarr · Post by **RinghioStarr** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 3:12 pm

Mike Boom wrote: Ringhio - Im not a huge fan of "Quarry" - dont like the production much and I think they left all the best songs off the record. I love "Never Played Symphonies", "Mexico" and "Munich Air Disaster...".
BUT "Ringleader" is top notch - not sure why you dislike it?

I agree about Quarry. The production is irritating, and a good tune as Mexico was left out. And it might have improved his public image, being an anti-racist song...
Also, Mexico has good (and not self-obsessive) lyrics and this leads me to Ringleader (but in general, to all his post-Vauxhall songs): I don't think he's a really good lyricist anymore. He lost wit, poetry, elegance and gained bad taste ("Dear God, Please Help Me" - incredibly boring, also), shallowness ("Life Is A Pigsty"), melodramatic banality ("You Have Killed Me"), detailed violence ("The Father Who Must Be Killed", the murder lyrics clash terribly with the beautiful musical bridge), plus some boring love ballads.
In these last albums, the music (which I don't like very much, anyway) is better than the lyrics. He can do better than that.

Well, at least he could...

Mechanical Grace · Post by **Mechanical Grace** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 5:58 pm

RinghioStarr wrote:I eagerly put my hands on Quarry as it came out, after the seven years' hiatus without Morrissey's releases, but it was a huge disappointment. He lost me since then. I almost never put that record on, and when I do... a "psychological teeth-grinding" starts. I think that its highlights are very catchy at best, but no more than that. It's the same old song, but without the inspiration.

Well, there's no use arguing over what's inspiring or catchy and what is not, but I couldn't agree with you less about Quarry. It'll be one of the top records of the Aughts decade for me, I'm certain. And I'll bet I'm not the only one. It's got at least 7 unstoppably great songs, imo. The sleeper on the record for me has been 'I Have Forgiven Jesus', which title may offend some, but it's meant as a song of piety, or the struggle for it. (Ditto Dear God Please Help Me, on the next record.) I don't think it's going out on a limb to say that his move to Rome has been both physical and psychological. I can't think how the topic of wrestling with one's faith and sexuality at the same time can be dull. There's some perfect Moz-style cynical pop on there, and some really moving stuff as well. For my Board 'location' I used this for a while, which I think is incredibly beautiful, end of story: "Drinking tea with the taste of the Thames / Sullenly, on a chair on the pavement."

As to Ringleader, I find it more spotty but still with some great moments. I suppose there will always be a he'll-never-be-what-he-once-was contingent, but personally these 2 records constitute a comeback that's much better than Elvis's, probably as good as Bowie's.

Who Shot Sam? · Post by **Who Shot Sam?** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 6:11 pm

Letters from Moz. Great stuff...

http://web.archive.org/web/200104080554 ... tters.html

Otis Westinghouse · Post by **Otis Westinghouse** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 6:25 pm

Nice one.

RinghioStarr wrote:He even mentions "piazza Cavour" but he gets the pronunciation wrong so that it can rhyme with "what's my life for"...

Is it more like 'cav-hour'? Shame the rhyme is wrong, cos I love that line. It's so teenage!

Mike Boom · Post by **Mike Boom** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:11 pm

Agree with you MG about "I Have Forgiven Jesus" - fantastic song.

Ive also been really enjoying the b-side to the latest single "I Just Want To See The Boy Happy" , "Sweetie Pie". A beautiful little song that has had the backing completely strangled and squashed with electronic squelches and distortion, leaving just the exquisite vocal standing on its own, and the odd burst of female backing vocals poking thru the noise, leaving the listener to fill in the melody - I see on the Morrissey Solo board all the silly little boys and girls are saying its the worst thing he's ever done - when it is , of course, absolutely brilliant.

Otis Westinghouse · Post by **Otis Westinghouse** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:29 pm

Sounds good. I agree with people who moaned on the same site about him playing Ganglord lots live. I think it's also a recent b-side. Haven't heard the recording, but live it's just dullsville, and sounds like more tedious obsessing over gangland.

Richard · Post by **Richard** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 8:47 pm

Glad to see the debate above regarding Morrissey's flirtation with race and patriotism. He never said anything to really smother the accusations.

My list may not add anything to those above, but wanted to contribute.

Late Night, Maudlin Street
King Leer
Spring Heeled Jim
Little Man, What Now?
I Am Hated For Loving
Hairdresser On Fire
Your Gonna Need Someone On Your Side
Alsatian Cousin
November Spawned A Monster
Used To Be A Sweet Boy

Otis Westinghouse · Post by **Otis Westinghouse** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 6:18 am

I recall a quote to the effect that 'how could anyone be so stupid to think that someone such as I could be racist?', but it probably wasn't even as explicit as that.

Nice and interesting list. I really do need to check out some of the songs on these lists I either don't know at all or very litttle.

Were you ever a Durutti Column enthusiast, Richard? Factory outfit from our era. Vini's still out there gigging and releasing, though I've yet to see him. You probably know the details, but Maudlin Street is very much his creation musically. There was some bitterness over Moz not giving him any sort of a credit on Viva Hate, but the story goes that he was brought in to make the music more interesting as Stephen Street was going for very cliched, obvious chords, and Vini made things more interesting, adding the lovely guitar lines to Suedehead, and basically composing all of the LNMS music. That's very much his trademark guitar style on there. In recent years he's said he's keen to set the record straight about the level of his involvement, but harbours no grudges and would work with Moz again if the chance arose (yes please!). Last year's LP Keep Breathing is recommended, and i read somewhere that he's recording a new one with a young female vocalist he thinks is brilliant, which could be good, as his non-singer singing is an obvious limitation.

Richard · Post by **Richard** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 11:39 pm

Not a huge enthusiast, Otis. I had Sketch For Summer and its companion Sketch For Winter. Both of which I loved.

If there is a great compilation that would catch me up, please let me know. I have enjoyed everything I have heard, & loved his Morrissey contributions.
I did not realise there had been bitterness between them, but with Morrissey it does seem to have atendancy to not end well.

Otis Westinghouse · Post by **Otis Westinghouse** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 6:59 pm

Good starting point is the Best of:

http://www.amazon.com/Best-Durutti-Colu ... F8&s=music

Contains those two sketches, plus some other very good early ones, plus my them tune! Hideous price for new copy on above link, but I'm sure you can find a cheaper one.